Nightgrass Lottery question

[zack_adcock]

Maybe I'm dense, but I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around this lottery thing ...

Based on the wording of the post, it sounds like signing up for one of the Nightgrass lotteries = buying tickets to the show(s) you requested tickets for. Now, I'm going with four other couples, and we're all going to put in for our two tickets each (two entries per household x 5 households = 10 entries total at two tickets each equals 20 potential tickets for ten people) to Railroad Earth.

So, if by strange luck of the draw we all get picked, do we LATER decide how many of us will buy tickets? Can we withdraw our entries to the lottery if our tickets are already accounted for? Or are we all 'betrothed' to the tickets we've won in the lottery?  In other words, if I enter the lottery for 2 RRE tickets and only end up needing ONE, am I committed to buying the two? Or can I choose to buy one at a later point in the transaction?  Or if I get tickets and don't need them, do those tickets go into the general pool as unclaimed (to go onsale April 8), or do we have a way of putting the tickets back into the lottery pool so someone else who had the foresight to enter the lottery can be drawn for them?

Perhaps I'm making this more complicated than it needs to be, but I'm trying to negotiate fairness with the absolute desire to end up with Nightgrass tickets.

If this is a stupid question please feel free to respond directly to me instead of causing a ruckus on the forum.

zack _ adcock @ yahoo . com

Zack

[JoeDunlap]

Once you place an order and if you're lucky enough to wn, you get charged for what you requested the day after the lottery. You cannot hold tickets and if you requested 2, you will get 2. They don't split up the ticket requests. And if you are fortunate enough to win extras I guarantee there will be PLENTY of people hangin' around the door of the Sheridan wanting to buy your extras.
GOOD LUCK!!!

[zack_adcock]

Obviously luck has a lot to do with it: I just don't have money to buy double the amount of tickets I need. The fact that there will be people who want them doesn't mean that I have money in my bank account to buy all of them. I guess I should just request what I need and hope for the best. I just want to go by this as honestly as my neighbors, you know?

Also, the fact that you can pay by check leads me to believe that you're NOT instantly charged for the ticket(s) if your number is drawn.

So, thanks for the input but I'm still confused.

[spewlanders]

DISCLAIMER: We can give Spewlanders credit for being a good Festivarian and trying to explain how the lottery works, but unfortunately the facts listed below are a bit off. Please see Brian's reply below for an explination on how this all works. (I added the disclaimer to avoid confusion)
Bluegrass Dustin


Here's my attempt at an explanation.

For Starters, as far as I understand it, you don't and can't request any particular show (whether you want YMSB, Railroad Earth or an all venue pass.  You simply enter the lottery and the random choosing of entries commences.  All the first entries that are chosen get the all venue passes, once enough entries are randomly chosen to fill that availability then the next so many that are chosen get Yonder tickets until those are all filled and then enough are randomly chosen to fill the availability for RRE tickets.  Get it? 

So you might actually be looking for RRE tickets and end up with Yonder or all access since you don't indicate a preference.  I'm sure that PB knows that the all venue is the most coveted followed by Yonder and then by RRE and the lottery is set up with that in mind.

We'll be entering and excited if we get any of the tickets for sure.  Although, i can see how this new system could be frustrating fof folks who want specific tickets and such.  Be sure though, if you can afford it \for a short time, there will be LOTS of folks willing to take extras off your hands so enter if you can.


How'd i Do??

as long as I'm here.... heres my two cents about the new system.

1)  IT does make it hard for people that only want to see one of the Sheridan shows to get the one they         
     want unless that can make trades with people that have the one they want.
2)  Oddly enough, it also makes it hard for anyone except those with the golden ticket to catch both Yonder     
      and RRE.

I realize that PB does all it can to be as fair they can and see that everyone has a shot to see the music  they want and many thanks go out to them.   I just wonder if this system might need a little tweaking?

peace

Obviously luck has a lot to do with it: I just don't have money to buy double the amount of tickets I need. The fact that there will be people who want them doesn't mean that I have money in my bank account to buy all of them. I guess I should just request what I need and hope for the best. I just want to go by this as honestly as my neighbors, you know?

Also, the fact that you can pay by check leads me to believe that you're NOT instantly charged for the ticket(s) if your number is drawn.

So, thanks for the input but I'm still confused.

[Auntie Hope]

1 All Venue Passes will be picked. If you get an All Venue Pass your out of the running for anything else. If you didn't get picked then your name goes back into the pot for the other drawings.

2 Yonder Only tickets will  be picked, then if there was a second request for RRE your entry will be thrown back into the pot.

3. RRE tickets will be picked.

That's how I read the page. If you want both YMSB and RRE you have two chances if you've put in for an All Venue Pass! 

Good Luck to All!

Auntie Hope 

[zack_adcock]

Ugh. Ok -- still doesn't make sense, though, as I only want to be entered for RRE tickets at the Sheridan. Is it unheard of to want tickets only to a specific show? I am still frustrated. Maybe someone from PB will post, or I'll call them later to confirm (though I teach school so I might not be able to catch them!)

ZA   

[yonderphreak]

I think that once the lottery form is live, it will be self explanatory.

[BluegrassBrian]

Hope described it perfectly. 

You have the option of ordering just RRE or just YMSB or just all-venue (or any combination thereof).  And for each of these you can order either 1 or 2 tix (or none). 

The only thing that makes it a little complicated is that if you ordered all-venue and RRE/YMSB tix, and you were chosen to get all-venue passes, then you won't be able to be selected for individual YMSB/RRE tix.  It goes against our goal of "fairness" (and limiting scalping) for the same order to get both all-venue passes and YMSB/RRE tix.  But if you don't get all-venue, then you're allowed to get both YMSB and RRE.  Make any more sense?

Cheers,
Brian

 Listening to: NPR

[l_grein]

OK...got my name in the hat...now today will be the longest day ever untill I find out if I got picked or not!!!

[marv]

Hope described it perfectly. 

You have the option of ordering just RRE or just YMSB or just all-venue (or any combination thereof).  And for each of these you can order either 1 or 2 tix (or none). 

The only thing that makes it a little complicated is that if you ordered all-venue and RRE/YMSB tix, and you were chosen to get all-venue passes, then you won't be able to be selected for individual YMSB/RRE tix.  It goes against our goal of "fairness" (and limiting scalping) for the same order to get both all-venue passes and YMSB/RRE tix.  But if you don't get all-venue, then you're allowed to get both YMSB and RRE.  Make any more sense?

Cheers,
Brian

brian -- you say that this system was put into place to limit scalping.  i don't see how this system will do anything but encourage scalping.

for instance:

i have a group of three people that want to go to a nightgrass show.  in order to get tickets, each of us put our names in the lottery for two tickets, in order to have the best chance at getting them.  however, now we're in a strange position.  if only one of our entries gets tickets, we have to buy a single ticket from someone at the fest.  if two of them get tickets, we have to sell one ticket to someone at the fest, and if all three of them get tickets, we have to sell three tickets to someone at the fest.

now, i plan on doing any non-sanctioned ticket buying/selling at face value, but i can't imagine everyone will.

i can't imagine having set up this lottery system while 1) only allowing people to enter for two tickets at a time (yes i know these tickets are in high demand, but this doesn't work very well for odd numbered groups of people) and 2) making you enter your credit card number before you know whether you've got the tickets.

it's strange having this lottery system set up and not allowing people to choose whether they want the tickets AFTER the lottery has been chosen.  with the way the system is set up, i have a feeling there will be many, many people who don't get the number of tickets they need and end up buying from or selling to a "scalper" at the festival.

[BluegrassDustin]

Marv -

The idea here is that by announcing the information yesterday, and having a relatively small window for people to enter the lottery, only those who are true fans/Festivarians will even know about the lottery at all.

You can select to purchase only 1 ticket, there is no obligation for each entry to put in for 2 tickets...though I understand your point about the odd numbered groups. Again this falls back to the hope that only the core group of Festivarians/ fans will get the tickets.

If you get extras, you will sell them to another Festivarian for face value...our hope is that most (if not all) of those who are lucky enough to know about the lottery and get tickets will be of the same mind frame you are. The small window and relatively limited lead time takes some of the "casual scalpers" out of the equation. By not having the lottery open for days we limit the number of folks who think to themselves, "gee...look what I found. I could enter this lottery and sell the tickets because those YMSB fans will pay my mortgage for the next 2 years to get into the show"

I/we realize this might not be the end all be all perfect answer...and I promise you we racked our brains trying to come up with the perfect answer. However, we do feel that this is the best way that we can keep the community of Festivarians involved, and keep the tickets (both used, and extras) in the hands of people who truly want and deserve to be in these shows...much like yourself.

I hope this helps give some insight as to why we did this, and addresses some of your concerns.

Good luck.



D.

Hope described it perfectly. 

You have the option of ordering just RRE or just YMSB or just all-venue (or any combination thereof).  And for each of these you can order either 1 or 2 tix (or none). 

The only thing that makes it a little complicated is that if you ordered all-venue and RRE/YMSB tix, and you were chosen to get all-venue passes, then you won't be able to be selected for individual YMSB/RRE tix.  It goes against our goal of "fairness" (and limiting scalping) for the same order to get both all-venue passes and YMSB/RRE tix.  But if you don't get all-venue, then you're allowed to get both YMSB and RRE.  Make any more sense?

Cheers,
Brian

brian -- you say that this system was put into place to limit scalping.  i don't see how this system will do anything but encourage scalping.

for instance:

i have a group of three people that want to go to a nightgrass show.  in order to get tickets, each of us put our names in the lottery for two tickets, in order to have the best chance at getting them.  however, now we're in a strange position.  if only one of our entries gets tickets, we have to buy a single ticket from someone at the fest.  if two of them get tickets, we have to sell one ticket to someone at the fest, and if all three of them get tickets, we have to sell three tickets to someone at the fest.

now, i plan on doing any non-sanctioned ticket buying/selling at face value, but i can't imagine everyone will.

i can't imagine having set up this lottery system while 1) only allowing people to enter for two tickets at a time (yes i know these tickets are in high demand, but this doesn't work very well for odd numbered groups of people) and 2) making you enter your credit card number before you know whether you've got the tickets.

it's strange having this lottery system set up and not allowing people to choose whether they want the tickets AFTER the lottery has been chosen.  with the way the system is set up, i have a feeling there will be many, many people who don't get the number of tickets they need and end up buying from or selling to a "scalper" at the festival.

[marv]

that's fine, and thanks for the reply.  i think all the problems i have with the system could have been fixed by offering the option to buy 3 tickets, and having the lottery be for a CHANCE to buy tickets, instead of having a lottery entry be an OBLIGATION to buy tickets.

[BluegrassDustin]

that's fine, and thanks for the reply.  i think all the problems i have with the system could have been fixed by offering the option to buy 3 tickets, and having the lottery be for a CHANCE to buy tickets, instead of having a lottery entry be an OBLIGATION to buy tickets.

understood.

The issue with the limit of 2 tickets boils down to the limited capacity of the venue. if we allowed 4 tickets for each order we essentially bring down the number of potential winners to less than 100. putting a cap on the number of tickets allows more people to receive them, as well as puts less tickets into the hands of potential scalpers, assuming that there are some in the mix. Let's say you didn't get tickets...would you rather a malicious scalper planning on selling the tickets for hundreds of dollars have 4, or just 2? With the system as it is now, you have a better chance of someone like yourself having 1 extra, as opposed to an opportunist who isn't even coming to the Telluride at all...and could leave the tickets unused when someone didn't pony up the money he expected to make...

As far as the Obligatory purchasing comment...

There is absolutely no way for us to track down the 350-400 people who will be selected throughout this lottery to see how many of the tickets they put in for that they would really like to purchase. It's just not feasible. it could take us till the festival to track everyone down and get payments. Not to mention what would we do with the 23 tickets that were accounted for in the lottery that were decided to be discarded? We are then left with a scenario where the same horde of folks who want tickets are trying for 23 tickets instead of 300.

I realize you are a bit frustrated...I can see it in the way you are typing.

I hope you'll realize that the "cut and dry" method we are using is the only one that makes sense for a band playing a 300 person room, when they will sell out Red Rocks just 2 months later.