Handing out tarp line numbers

[erndog]

the dreaded 'tarp line' thread returns . . . .

[HuckinFappy]

"Dreaded"?  It just means we've gone over the precipice, and moved from "anticipation" to "preparation"

[annpete]

"Dreaded"?  It just means we've gone over the precipice, and moved from "anticipation" to "preparation"

   
See y'all soon!

 Listening to: People partying in the lobby of the hotel...

[Iriecycle]

"Dreaded"?  It just means we've gone over the precipice, and moved from "anticipation" to "preparation"

or is it perspiration.  I've seen the numbers go over 500, fer shigidy.

 Listening to: Blind Melon

[headlight]

Does 500 numbers sound right?  I think that is correct, but perhaps someone from PB can confirm.

Seems about right to me.  I had a 485 last year, but never anything over 500.  I was in Mt. Village last year, so 7:20 was the earliest I ever got in line, and I got a number every day.

Good to know as this will be our fist time staying up the Hill and I was wondering how to deal with the situation; or if it would even be possible to deal with it, Tarp wise that is.
So I won't ressurect the thread I started a few years ago about kids selling their #s to other folks standing in line then. 

 Listening to: More David Nelson Band

[FaceOnMars]

Does 500 numbers sound right?  I think that is correct, but perhaps someone from PB can confirm.

Seems about right to me.  I had a 485 last year, but never anything over 500.  I was in Mt. Village last year, so 7:20 was the earliest I ever got in line, and I got a number every day.

Good to know as this will be our fist time staying up the Hill and I was wondering how to deal with the situation; or if it would even be possible to deal with it, Tarp wise that is.
So I won't ressurect the thread I started a few years ago about kids selling their #s to other folks standing in line then. 

http://www.number-it.com/home/handstamps/

^ problem solved re: "scalping numbers" (combined with an official TBF stamp which is different each day).  Would just need to act relatively quickly after random numbers are drawn to give people a stamp.

[BillyBeru]

FOM,

You like to stir this line number business, don't ya? I seem to recall you bringing this topic up last year as well.

I find it even more interesting that you've actually never even done the line before yet you have such strong opinions.

Well, I've done the line every year, often multiple nights. It can suck when it's particularly cold, etc.

But I've had too many great memories in that line- meeting new people, carousing with those I haven't seen a while.

My .02 cents- Planet, don't change a thing until you see fit. I've trusted you all these years and you have not let me down.

 

[Hot Sugar]

I've spent many a night in line and ran a few tarps in the past couple of years and I'd be very hesitant to get behind a hand stamp. For several camps, the people sitting in line don't run the tarp; it's a team effort. Someone gets the number, and then the faster people run. The way I look at it, once I've got a number, that number belongs to my camp, not to me specifically. I'm with Billy on this one; it works the way it is now, so why try to fix it?

[BillyBeru]

Sugar, we've gone down the rabbit hole on this topic...again.

The original goal of the topic was # of numbers handed out. General consensus is somewhere north of five hundred.

Looks like that is settled. Lets avoid any irrelevant discussions about the opinion of the line

[erndog]

"Looks like that is settled. Lets avoid any irrelevant discussions about the opinion of the line"

And while you're at it . . . GET OFF MY LAWN!!!

[landshark]

Ok I have this great idea for the line and how to deal.

 A line Bodybag, pockets full of munchies, heat reflective quilted fabric that glows in the dark...hua, hua.....? Think about it, a built in port o potty......

A coffee Maker, if it rains you pull it up and snap down the top for an instant shelter a built in chair..

PBG loves this crap this topic has been hashed over for a century....LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it is perfect the way it is

[landshark]

I've spent many a night in line and ran a few tarps in the past couple of years and I'd be very hesitant to get behind a hand stamp. For several camps, the people sitting in line don't run the tarp; it's a team effort. Someone gets the number, and then the faster people run. The way I look at it, once I've got a number, that number belongs to my camp, not to me specifically. I'm with Billy on this one; it works the way it is now, so why try to fix it?

  Thank you again Sugar

[FaceOnMars]

FOM,

You like to stir this line number business, don't ya? I seem to recall you bringing this topic up last year as well.

I find it even more interesting that you've actually never even done the line before yet you have such strong opinions.

Well, I've done the line every year, often multiple nights. It can suck when it's particularly cold, etc.

But I've had too many great memories in that line- meeting new people, carousing with those I haven't seen a while.

My .02 cents- Planet, don't change a thing until you see fit. I've trusted you all these years and you have not let me down.

 

I don't know Billy, but I guess it's my sense of "fair play" in light of the large number of overall shows I see annually which draws me into the whole tarp issue.  I've had lots of varied experience as it relates to personal space and concert / festival crowds ... and have given the general topic a good deal of reflection over the years as it relates to balancing the overall common good vs. personal interests.

I'll concede that some issues related to tarps are difficult.  Tarp size being one which is nebulous and hard to enforce, but randomization of the tarp line order seems to be a "no brainer" as far as being able to mitigate the huge demand of primo real estate in light of the "systems" (to acquire such) which have evolved.   Randomization could be the single most effective and easiest to implement method of leveling the playing field.

Seems to me that PB has always been cognizant of the changing dynamics and has adapted very well to navigate the waters as an impartial "referee" in so far as improving/tweaking their policies.  I believe the whole M&S nightgrass ticket sale policy is an excellent example of this.  While Lyons might be logistically different, apparently randomization is an acceptable policy which PB has already used at another venue.

Since I don't have an immediate horse in this race, some could say I might have an even more unbiased take on things ... although I'd consider getting in line early if it didn't require the extra ordinary measures.  I'd be willing to bet others would too.  From a marketing standpoint, the more people who are afforded a reasonable opportunity to get better real estate without having to go through all sorts of contortions, the more widely dispersed a sense of "engagement" will be for a greater number of festivarians (aka PB customers).

As far as the "atmosphere and carousing" in the tarp line:  I wouldn't expect anything less, but believe it is more a function of the festivarian spirit making lemonade out of lemons (as a crude metaphor) vs. an "event" people seek out for it's own sake.  It's not like PB would be depriving us of anything we couldn't do on our own accord if they moved toward randomization.

For the record:  while I might feel strongly, I've never started a tarp thread & I didn't even know for sure how number assignments worked until yesterday.

[completejohn]

I just got back from Jazz Fest in New Orleans.  Yes, it's a much bigger festival, but they had many of the same problems.

A couple of years ago, they instituted a "no chair" zone in front of the sound board.  No chairs, no tarps, just standing room only.  It works well.  It makes navigation through the crowd MUCH easier, and the SRO crowds change as the acts change.  That lets the fans of one band get close when the first band leaves.  It also allows more people to get up close because there are no chairs just taking up space.

This year they took on the tarp size problem.  They had their volunteer ushers moving through the tarp and chair zone, and made people fold their tarps into the correct size.  It was really interesting because other tarpers would follow the ushers around and grab the new spaces as they became available. 

It would shock me if PB decided to change the tarp line procedure, if only because it's a real tradition.  But if they did decide to try something (random numbers (maybe each wrist band has four tarpline numbers printed on them?) or moving the tarp line indoors to the hockey arena) perhaps a one-year or even one DAY trial would let us see if we like it or not.  It's obvious that PB does listen to us, and it's equally obvious that they would want to try things to make the world's best festival even better.

[erndog]

I can't believe I am contributing to this ridiculous  thread . . . 

"Randomization could be the single most effective and easiest to implement method of leveling the playing field."

The Planet's done the 'somewhat' randomization thing in Lyons with Rockygrass and Folks - it works . . . just kinda OK.  Lot's of people trying to game the system - last year they basically shut down the distribution of numbers right in the middle of handing them out, they guys giving out the numbers were so pissed off and frustrated - - so don't think that 'randomization' is a great idea or a solution - it's just one idea, and one they are trying to tinker with at Rockygrass and Folks.

The line situation in Telluride isn't perfect, but in some ways - more democratic.  You wanna be first in line for tomorrow and GET RIGHT UP FRONT - well, you get your ass in line the night before.  What could possibly be more democratic and a more level playing field than that -

Except it sucks and, yes, that may mean missing some of the acts that are appearing on stage at the moment you are waiting in line . . . not for me, but I'll do my part, like when staggering home to Town Park after a 'spirited' night of nightgrass to help out others in line . . .

but let's face it - it really isn't necessary to wait in line all night to enjoy the festival the next day . . .

* you can sit on anyone's tarp when they are not there - and a lot of the time there is premium unoccupied tarp space  - and most people leave after seeing 'their favorite band', some make new friends, etc.

* when it gets dark and the headliners come one - most of the space up front becomes standing room only anyway - people pack up the tarps and chairs after sundown, some put on warmer clothes and prefer to stand, some just pack it in and go back to camp

* some of the best music and most intimate moments weren't on the main stage at all - they are either at nightgrass (did I mention spirited?), or at Elks Park, which is just a gem, in my opinion

* some people I know have made a tradition of the 'wait overnight in line thing' - hey, good for them . . . it's part of the festival, for them . . . they do what they do . . .

enough . . . I hope I made my point . . .