how long has scalping been legal?

[BillyBeru]

Equilibrium is achieved when supply equals demand, but what causes that to occur is the economically optical price.

Darn it, you brought out the "optical" rebuttal defense. My case is blown. 

[HuckinFappy]

Equilibrium is achieved when supply equals demand, but what causes that to occur is the economically optical price.

Darn it, you brought out the "optical" rebuttal defense. My case is blown. 

He can see right through you

[BillyBeru]

Equilibrium is achieved when supply equals demand, but what causes that to occur is the economically optical price.

Darn it, you brought out the "optical" rebuttal defense. My case is blown. 

He can see right through you

 

 

[swander99]

"Festilibrium" is achieved when I have a wrist full of TBF passes on one hand, and a RANGER in the other.  Takes good care of my demand and supply!  Can we leave yet?

[Rob_from_Ohio]

"Festilibrium" is achieved when I have a wrist full of TBF passes on one hand, and a RANGER in the other.  Takes good care of my demand and supply!  Can we leave yet?

Brilliant!  Festilibrium.  I love it.  I'm thirsty for the bluegrass and the Ranger.   

[Auntie Hope]

If I were to sell my ticket, I'd need to cover my condo rental... So, $155 for the ticket, $1400 for the condo... Would I even sell it for $1,500?  Probably not;

You've confused something here. Your ticket buyer should not be responsible for your condo reservation, at all. Two separate issues that need to be sent back into the world. Even considering them as one unit would be totally un-Festivarian like. You're not like that and we know it too. 

Here's the deal. If you do not buy from scalpers they do not make money, their bottom line ends up in the lost column. They think twice next year about which festivals to "highjack" tickets from before hand.

One of the ways they do get away with outrageous pricing is by offering "ticket packages" in which the ticket is only one item on a list of offerings, i.e., limo to event, hotel, etc...... so if you do find yourself going this route, make sure they produce ALL the goods offered.

[BluegrassDustin]

Many of the scalpers you see this year are not professional scalpers at all...

Due to the twilight zoneish demand we've had this year regular folks who were planning on attending the festival are simply attempting to make a quick buck off those who REALLY want to go and can afford it.

It's not a business for most of the ticket holders you see out there selling tickets. It's someone being opportunistic and attempting to take advantage of the unusual circumstances present this year.

I know it's hard, but just keep your head high and continue to politely remind anyone you see selling tickets for over face that it's not the Festivarian way.

I'd sure like to see the "discussion" of, say, $350 tickets if we were to properly "value" the festival.

[ShatteredArm]

If I were to sell my ticket, I'd need to cover my condo rental... So, $155 for the ticket, $1400 for the condo... Would I even sell it for $1,500?  Probably not;

You've confused something here. Your ticket buyer should not be responsible for your condo reservation, at all. Two separate issues that need to be sent back into the world. Even considering them as one unit would be totally un-Festivarian like. You're not like that and we know it too. 

Here's the deal. If you do not buy from scalpers they do not make money, their bottom line ends up in the lost column. They think twice next year about which festivals to "highjack" tickets from before hand.

One of the ways they do get away with outrageous pricing is by offering "ticket packages" in which the ticket is only one item on a list of offerings, i.e., limo to event, hotel, etc...... so if you do find yourself going this route, make sure they produce ALL the goods offered.

They need to cover the cost of the condo in order for it to make my selling the ticket worthwhile... Otherwise, I am stuck with a condo I do not want.  I am just using this as an example of why it is cheaper to buy from a scalper rather than someone who actually intends on attending the festival.  $800 is a $650 profit for the scalper, but a $700 loss for me (because I paid $1500 for my trip plans).

You're correct that if you don't buy from them, they lose money.  Except for that to work, *nobody* can buy from them, and if there are people for whom the desire to attend the festival is greater than the desire to stick it to the scalpers--and there are--all you have done is locked yourself out of the festival.  And I guarantee you that your boycott is not going to hurt the scalper's feelings.

These things are not guaranteed income for scalpers; it's a lot like stock options: if you correctly predict demand, you can win, but the value is guaranteed to hit zero if you don't unload your goods in time.

[Auntie Hope]

Equilibrium is achieved when supply equals demand, but what causes that to occur is the economically optical price.

Darn it, you brought out the "optical" rebuttal defense. My case is blown. 

You are BOTH wrong. The price is just right and you two number crunchers are "not optically focused on" the human aspect and history of this festival, which would in fact be the hippie factor, and the aging hippies that started this fun little event. The fact that they are now headed for or at retirement age and possible fixed incomes plays a very large part in those same folks being able to make their 30th or 37th year in a row. Hell, there's tons of us, especially in this rotten economy, that save our change all year long just to be able to buy these tickets in the first place as soon as they go on sale. Planet Bluegrass is aware! They are also aware of the need for "new blood" to sustain the fest for years to come.

Planet Bluegrass knows, and further more, they know their Festivarians and how much we have, and actually do, make the scene come alive every year. It's history.

There are tons of "factors" and you two have argued them, quite well in fact. But the simple truth remains.......

Planet Bluegrass is the ONLY organization that has ANY free market rights concerning this event. After that, they're all pigs taking advantage of the situation.

Shouldn't you two be making plans to drink beer together by now???

End of my freakin' rant.   
Auntie Hope

[Auntie Hope]

If I were to sell my ticket, I'd need to cover my condo rental... So, $155 for the ticket, $1400 for the condo... Would I even sell it for $1,500?  Probably not;

You've confused something here. Your ticket buyer should not be responsible for your condo reservation, at all. Two separate issues that need to be sent back into the world. Even considering them as one unit would be totally un-Festivarian like. You're not like that and we know it too. 

Here's the deal. If you do not buy from scalpers they do not make money, their bottom line ends up in the lost column. They think twice next year about which festivals to "highjack" tickets from before hand.

One of the ways they do get away with outrageous pricing is by offering "ticket packages" in which the ticket is only one item on a list of offerings, i.e., limo to event, hotel, etc...... so if you do find yourself going this route, make sure they produce ALL the goods offered.

They need to cover the cost of the condo in order for it to make my selling the ticket worthwhile... Otherwise, I am stuck with a condo I do not want.  I am just using this as an example of why it is cheaper to buy from a scalper rather than someone who actually intends on attending the festival.  $800 is a $650 profit for the scalper, but a $700 loss for me (because I paid $1500 for my trip plans).

You're correct that if you don't buy from them, they lose money.  Except for that to work, *nobody* can buy from them, and if there are people for whom the desire to attend the festival is greater than the desire to stick it to the scalpers--and there are--all you have done is locked yourself out of the festival.  And I guarantee you that your boycott is not going to hurt the scalper's feelings.

These things are not guaranteed income for scalpers; it's a lot like stock options: if you correctly predict demand, you can win, but the value is guaranteed to hit zero if you don't unload your goods in time.

Worthwhile? As in it's best if I get no money back rather than just the ticket cost. You're joking... right...?  I'm sorry, I forgot it was all about your need when you found out you couldn't make it for the fest. Why else would you be selling that ticket and trying to dump that condo? Anyone in their RIGHT MIND wouldn't be exchanging this experience, camping or in a condo, just for some cold cash.

Son, I believe the phrase in the South would be something to the effect of.....

"That ______ is dumber than a box of rocks."

The proper response for any buyer, with a pat on the back of course, "Well, bless yer heart, you did get yer self up in this canyon, even tho it did cost ya six months wages. Goody for you, Sweetie." or perhaps, "I do believe you have more money than brains now, don't you?"

Let me ask ya something, Son. Do you really need to sell off that condo or are you just arguing for arguments sake, kinda anti-festivatin' like, being a downer for downers sake.... I'm sure you get the picture. I'm just curious.

[ShatteredArm]

Worthwhile? As in it's best if I get no money back rather than just the ticket cost. You're joking... right...?  I'm sorry, I forgot it was all about your need when you found out you couldn't make it for the fest. Why else would you be selling that ticket and trying to dump that condo? Anyone in their RIGHT MIND wouldn't be exchanging this experience, camping or in a condo, just for some cold cash.

I don't think you're correctly understanding my hypothetical situation.  I am, in fact, attending the festival, and staying in my condo; I was simply attempting to show what it would take to get me to not go, and instead sell the ticket to someone.  I was simply trying to point out that you could get a ticket from a scalper for far cheaper than you could get one from me.

Perhaps the following question would better prove my point: how much would someone have to pay you before you considered giving up your ticket?

[Auntie Hope]

Worthwhile? As in it's best if I get no money back rather than just the ticket cost. You're joking... right...?  I'm sorry, I forgot it was all about your need when you found out you couldn't make it for the fest. Why else would you be selling that ticket and trying to dump that condo? Anyone in their RIGHT MIND wouldn't be exchanging this experience, camping or in a condo, just for some cold cash.

I don't think you're correctly understanding my hypothetical situation.  I am, in fact, attending the festival, and staying in my condo; I was simply attempting to show what it would take to get me to not go, and instead sell the ticket to someone.  I was simply trying to point out that you could get a ticket from a scalper for far cheaper than you could get one from me.

Perhaps the following question would better prove my point: how much would someone have to pay you before you considered giving up your ticket?

and your answer would be...

"Hey Bonehead, we like you more than that and we'd miss you! Don't sell your ticket! Sheesh! Why the hell would you even suggest such a thing? Even hypo crap like that can get you banned from the forum. Did you think about that?" 

[erndog]

I would imagine that a lot this year's demand has to do with Phish playing last year in Telluride - call it the Phish factor -  I'm sure a lot of those phish fans have been to TBF before, especially the Colorado fans - - but there were probably a lot who have never been to TBF.

So you go to Telluride for the first time, see Phish, look around and (like everyone else that's been to t-ride) say to yourself, "this is killer, they have a 4-day bluegrass fest here in June every year?" . . . and bang, a whole other group of people want to come to Telluride - - and this group KNOWS how to order on-line, manage ticket lotteries, scalp tickets, buy big blocs of tickets for their buddies, etc.

Hey, man, this is a popular, well-run event . . . and gets more and more exposure every year . . . I'm not surprised there's no tickets to be had at this time . . . and I'm sure next year won't be any better . . .

[swander99]

  I get it SA, but I'm not quite sure AuntieH does?  You're not interested in selling your ticket. Period. BUT, if you were to get an offer high enough to pay all your expenses already spent, you STILL wouldn't do it. Right? THAT'S why it'd be cheaper to buy from a scalper? Still not a good enough reason in my book. Plan ahead, pay ahead. Doesn't matter what happened last year, or any other year. Get'r'done! It's a hard year for patience fersure! 

[BillyBeru]

You are BOTH wrong. The price is just right and you two number crunchers are "not optically focused on"
Shouldn't you two be making plans to drink beer together by now???

In the spirit of The Big Lebowski, I offer the following:

Dude: "What the @$!@ are you talking about, Walter."
Donny: "Yeah, Walter, what are you talking about?"

Shattered Arm, I get your drift - we can talk about it (but most likely we will be chilling to the music) over a cold one at the beer tent.